Coldheartedtruth

Passing it will probably have consequences. But not passing it would be worse.

All you have to do is look at the most recent republican congress: the "do nothing" 109th. The republicans did little to excite their base and did crap to piss off the other side. That, combined with scandals and presidential unpopularity, caused a disaster in the ensuing elections.

Democrats have to have some meaningful accomplishment. The vitriol will die down once it gets passed.

I think those blue dogs in conservative districts are going down no matter how they vote, and weak incumbents in the senate like Reid or Dodd may also go down. The democrats are basically maxed out on red districts they can claim. There's nowhere to go but down.

The only thing "worse" for the Democratic Party than not passing Health care reform... would be passing health care reform. Because it will be an albatross around their necks for elections to come.

I see sunshine, lillipops and rainbows with pelosi/Obama's social engineering.

I just wish they'd hurry up and pass it.

Once it's done, and it's in black and white, with Obama's signature, Obama can't deny any of it.

As it stands right now, he's able to prance around the country touting, in his oblique way, something that doesn't exist.

"Healthcare" to Obama is in crisis - lol!

What better ammunition for the Republicans - a "crisis" that won't be "fixed" until 2013 - now - there's change you can believe in!

In the meantime, democratics will continue their taxing and spending (they can't help themselves), continue their social engineering (they can't help themselves), people will continue to see their dollars dwindle in value, unemployment will rise even further (thanks to the "quick" no-fix "stimulus" crap sandwich/band-aid), small businesses will still be feeling the cash crunch and people will still be afraid to spend too much money on unnecessary expenditures (thanks to the "quick" no-fix "stimulus" crap sandwich/band-aid).

Wait until the crap and trade bill goes into effect, GM and Chrysler will still be in trouble a year from now - talk about angry Americans.

We can only hope Obama starts pimping a "stimulus" part deux in the next six months - that should nip it, nip it, nip it!

Hopefully, the Republican politicians have returned to their roots of conservative spending and will start looking out for our tax dollars again.

It's a tough lesson - but a lesson that needs to be relearned every 30 years or so.

Obama makes W look like a piker and Carter like a conservative.

**The only thing "worse" for the Democratic Party than not passing Health care reform... would be passing health care reform. Because it will be an albatross around their necks for elections to come.**

that would be true if the main stream media reported it. but instead, they report only what this president wants them to report. what it will do is further polarize dems and republicans, but again, the media will blame the gop for it instead of obama.

Reports of a Democratic demise have been greatly exagerrated.

I take it, Coldhardlytrooth, that you do not agree with Dole's assessment that passing a bill will lead to a ten point leap in Obama's approval rating.

Because it will be an albatross around their necks for elections to come.

I agree, IF the Baucus bill is the one signed. I think we both know that the bill Obama signs will be very different than this bill.

**I think we both know that the bill Obama signs will be very different than this bill. **

i think this is true. which makes all the reporting about sen. snowe's yes vote much ado about nothing.

makes all the reporting about sen. snowe's yes vote much ado about nothing.

Agreed

**passing a bill will lead to a ten point leap in Obama's approval rating. **


Perhaps...at least until Joe Lunchbag figures out how much it will cost him, and how little it will offer him, and that the government now completely owns his soul.

After that, I am pretty confident the Dems lose a few points.

...much ado about nothing...

There's one thing that worries me about the Snowe matter, however. A lot of the analysis this morning seems to be saying,
"Now that the Obama White House has got her, they intend to do whatever it takes to keep her, and she has clearly stated that she will NOT vote for a bill with a public option."

Unless that's just political cover that she may later be willing to abandon, I view that grimly.

Or, Joe Lunchbag may suddenly see that he is no longer at the mercy of a merciless healthcare system in which the insurers imperiled his body if not his soul, and that "big" government is not so bad when it STRONGLY goes to bat on behalf of all the people.

Government of, by, and for the people.
Not of, by, and for the insurers.

***JamesNewLeaf says: Concerning Snow and public option, this sounds a bit better, imho***

Oct 14, 9:58 AM EDT
By RICARDO ALONSO-ZALDIVAR
Associated Press Writer
...Sen. Snowe backed Finance version of health care bill because it's a 'good place to start'

WASHINGTON (AP) - Sen. Olympia Snowe, the only Republican to support the Finance Committee's health care bill, said Wednesday she could foresee a government-run plan that would "kick in" if private insurers failed to live up to expectations.

Snowe emphasized that she still opposes the so-called public option, but said she also believes the private insurance market must yield a system in which health coverage becomes more widely accessible and affordable.

"I think the government would have a disproportionate advantage" in the event of a government-run option, the Maine Republican said in a nationally broadcast interview. Snowe said "at the same time, I want to make sure the insurance industry performs, and that's why we eliminate many egregious practices."

If the industry didn't follow through on congressionally-mandated changes aimed at overhauling the delivery of medical services, she said, "then you could have the public option kick in immediately."

Snowe previously had proposed using the public option as an incentive, or a threat, to private insurers who do not make their plans affordable by certain deadlines. This "trigger" option, or some version of it, has survived the bitter debate and scrutiny to remain a viable option for compromise.

Snowe broached this standby notion again as talks among lawmakers on health care were going back behind closed doors; Senate leaders are trying to merge two very different bills into a new version that can get the 60 votes needed to guarantee passage.
...the article continues and signals still to come 'breaking news'...

Perhaps...at least until Joe Lunchbag figures out how much it will cost him, and how little it will offer him, and that the government now completely owns his soul.

Exactly.

We had that discussion yesterday. From what the CBO says, this isn't going to save anyone very much money - health insurance would still cost the middle class 18% to 19% of their income.

That's not very much when you're giving so much control to the gubmint...

Anyway, Dole didn't say what he said he said.

Dole said if Obama would "lead" his numbers would go up 10 points.

He also said Obama needs to be out front with his specific plan, so Americans wouldn't be confused.

which makes all the reporting about sen. snowe's yes vote much ado about nothing.

True - and also not a surprise.

I will be perfectly honest here.

In this debate, that would be a first.

so joe lieberman opposes the bill. i guess she's the true democrat maverick.

**e also said Obama needs to be out front with his specific plan, so Americans wouldn't be confused.**

but if he did that, there would be something specific to criticize. this way, he gets to keep making vague remarks that remain debatable rather than directly refutable.

I take it, Coldhardlytrooth, that you do not agree with Dole's assessment that passing a bill will lead to a ten point leap in Obama's approval rating.

No I don't... Dole also though he could win the Presidency and couldn't even get my vote.

Filed Under:NoBalls hates America.

something specific to criticize.

So you admit You're just looking to bash Obama no matter what he does or says.

Obama is going to be president for the next 7 years. Because of the failure of Reaganism and pathetic George, the repulicons will be out of power for another generation at least.
YOUR WAY DON'T WORK!
Live with it.

I agree, IF the Baucus bill is the one signed. I think we both know that the bill Obama signs will be very different than this bill.

The Baucus bill is both the best and the worst... it's the only one that has any chance of passing and yet it's the one that accomplishes really nothing of substance.

but if he did that, there would be something specific to criticize. this way, he gets to keep making vague remarks that remain debatable rather than directly refutable.

Which is exactly why I said -

I just wish they'd hurry up and pass it.

Once it's done, and it's in black and white, with Obama's signature, Obama can't deny any of it.

As it stands right now, he's able to prance around the country touting, in his oblique way, something that doesn't exist.

Grannted, this is just anecdotal and based simply upon my listening to Mark Levin screaming, and reading what has recently happened to Lindsay Graham and other, admittedly partisan sites.

But it seems to me, the Republican party right now, is just about headed over the cliff into InsaneVille. Levin is SCREAMING, literally, about people like Graham, Snowe, McCain and anyone else who isn't a hard right, and I mean HARD right doctrinaire Republican.

The teabaggers seem to be taking over. It's pretty evident here too, as CH is moving rightward at an accellerating pace, rat, the libertarian/fascist is livid, ettiot, well, who cares?

But it seems to this observer, that there is only one functional party in the US right now, barely, and it is the Democrats. From Ben Nelson on the right, to I dunno, three or four true lefties like Feingold and Boxer, the ideological spectrum is pretty well covered. On the right, DeMint, and "YOU LIE" seem to be the ones who control the agenda now days.

The Republican party has always had it's fringe, and they have always had some influence. BUT, now it seems, at least to me, the inmates have taken over the asylum.

Dole also though he could win the Presidency and couldn't even get my vote.

Mine either.

I still haven't forgiven him for lying back in 1967.

The Baucus bill isn't the only one that has a chance for passage, CH. Not in the least.

As I said, you have moved so far right in the last 3-4 years you have lost what objectivity you had.

As I said, you have moved so far right in the last 3-4 years you have lost what objectivity you had.

We know, we know - that's why you're not going to contribute to the "tip jar"...

It's pretty evident here too, as CH is moving rightward at an accellerating pace, rat, the libertarian/fascist is livid, ettiot, well, who cares?

Apparently - you.

Filed Under:CH hates America!

accomplishes really nothing of substance.

So you want to see the insurance industry bankrupt the country.
Anything except Obama succeeding.

**So you admit You're just looking to bash Obama no matter what he does or says.**

no. guess again nitwit.

BTW -

But it seems to this observer, that there is only one functional party in the US right now, barely, and it is the Democrats.

LMAO!

**So you want to see the insurance industry bankrupt the country.**

he said while ignoring the huge federal deficit obama is building...

The bill that comes out of the house, WILL have a public option. And if the Dems have any cojones at all, they will beat back a fillibuster attempt, have a healthy debate, and in the end, include a public OPTION. The Baucus bill is a STARTING point. The bill that comes out of conference, will contain portions of, but not be "the Baucus bill".

Geebus.

I will eventually contribute to the 'tip jar' but the one post CH put up, that was little more than a right wing screed, pissed me off.

This is supposed to be a place for pundity, polling and analysis.

CH seems to have abandoned the latter completely.

He wrote a while back about his rightward drift, and it is still in progress.

Filed Under:Watch NoBalls dance.

no. guess again nitwit.

I give up what do you want?
REAGANISM destroyed the middle class so that's out of the question.

We have the best health care system in the world! I read it on CHT!

According to Americans the United States does not have the best health care in the world. Most see our health care as average (32%) or below average (27%) when compared with health care in other industrialized countries. Only 15% support the often-used political talking point that America has the best health care in the world; 23% say it is above average.

America has the best health care in the world

We probably do. That's not the problem. It's access to it that is bankrupting the country.
Insurance companies are sucking up profits and adding to the expense of the providers at the same time.

Without real reform, it's gonna just keep getting worse.

For those who can afford it, we do have the best health care in the world. But our delivery system is a clusterfuck. And it is too damn expensive per capita.

This reform, in the long run, will address both issues. It will be, as most things are, a work in progress for a long, long time to come.

But the status quo, is simply unacceptable.

And really, the major reason for Republican opposition is not ideological, although that is a factor, it is about the short term. The mid term elections next year is THE major driving force. Party Uber Alles.

The most telling line in the CH comment.

The only people who will benefit is those who will recieve some form of "subsidy" towards their insurance premium or those who have pre-existing conditions or are closing in on their life-time limtes (sic)

In a lot of ways, this is how the Republicans want to frame this debate. It's just another goddamn welfare program, designed to take his hard earned money and give it to someone who won't work.

That is NOT what this bill OR the final bill will do, but that is for certain, how many Republicans see it.

It's as dishonest as Reagan's oft repeated line about Cadillac driving welfare queens. It panders to the worst of our emotions and is based on a false premise.

Filed Under:NoBalls phony conservative logic.

huge federal deficit obama is building

Everyone agrees stimulus is needed to get Bush's failed economy started again.
What happened to all the jobs BushCo's tax breaks for corporations (those who create jobs) was supposed to provide?
How much did Bush's blunder in Iraq add to the deficit?

Face it NoBalls.
YOUR WAY DON'T WORK!

It's just another goddamn welfare program, designed to take his hard earned money and give it to someone who won't work.

Welfare/exchange subsidies - what's the different.

Analysis of Exchange Subsidies

Just get it done, already.

Get Obama's name on the dotted line - that's all I'm waitin' for...

Everyone agrees stimulus is needed to get Bush's failed economy started again.

Too bad Obama didn't pass a real "stimulus" package - instead we got a "stimulus" crap sandwich/band-aid.

*difference

Filed Under:Lissaette you ignorant, arrogant slut! #32

Too bad Obama didn't pass a real "stimulus" package

You mean like tax breaks for the corporations at the same time wasting blood and national treasure in Iraq?

How did that work out stimulating the economy?

Filed Under:Lissaettes fantasy world.

Too bad Obama didn't pass a real "stimulus" package

The Dow Jones Industrial Average surged 105 points, to 9976, closing in on the closely watched 10,000 mark -- a level it hasn't seen since Oct. 3, 2008.

We (The US under the leadership of President Bush) won in Iraq.


10 percent unemployment is what the stimulas has created and that number is going to go higher.

The stimulas money that was going to go to ACORN has been cut off, that is a savings.

The stimuless act was about net job creation, it has failed.

Good to see that most liberals on this board have changed thier tune when it comes to the stock market.

Earning reports are coming in and companies are making a profit, profits drive wages and the market going higher.

Libs being for companies making ever higher profits is a good sign that there is still hope for them.

Health Care/Ins. Act will cost those of us with private health care insurance even more and those that are going on the gov't plan (what ever that might be) will have more of thier plan paid for, futhering the need for those being held in the public trust to vote Democrat.

The teabaggers seem to be taking over. It's pretty evident here too, as CH is moving rightward at an accellerating pace, rat, the libertarian/fascist is livid, ettiot, well, who cares?

i'm not livid. i'm seeing the passage of this shitpile as a win-win for my side.

it can be hung around the necks of dems in 2010, it is very likely unconstitutional, and it can always be repealed after the fact by a sensible and logical legislature.

Very smart man -

"bob russell wrote:

Let's see now, this bill raises the cost of insurance, increases taxes on insurance companies, reduces Medicare spending by $500 billion and imposes all kinds of penalties on people who have no insurance including prison. Is there anything good about this bill? Well, it does give coverage to those with preexisting conditions.

Instead of ruining health insurance for the 85% of the people who are happy with the present system, why didn't they just do something for the 10 million people who don't have insurance but who want it? The two most obvious improvements that could have been made was tort reform and allowing insurance companies to compete across state lines. They should be ashamed."

The Baucus Bill Is a Tax Bill

"Most astounding of all is what this Congress is willing to do to struggling middle-class families. The bill would impose nearly $400 billion in new taxes and fees. Nearly 90% of that burden will be shouldered by those making $200,000 or less."

it can be hung around the necks of dems in 2010, it is very likely unconstitutional, and it can always be repealed after the fact by a sensible and logical legislature.

Exactly - all we need is Obama's "John Henry" on the dotted line.

The idiot twins from Kansas lie again.

N]early eight months after its passage, a large majority of the stimulus has yet to start impacting the economy—as was the plan. And as was also the plan, the most visible parts of the stimulus are only taking effect now and will remain active through 2010. As you drive around town, it's difficult to visualize tax rebates or aid to states—the fast-acting components of the stimulus. But as I drive around my town today, I can see workers laboring at a $4 million, stimulus-backed road project that is just getting started and will run through the spring of 2011...the debate over whether the stimulus worked will ultimately be settled in 2012—as voters go to the polls and economists crunch the 2011 data. Until then, we should avoid jumping to rash conclusions.

Unconstitutional

LMAO

You are a fucking idiot.

I've heard lawyers, conservative lawyers, tell idiots like you rat, that your dreams of claiming health care reform will be unconstitutional as a pipe dream.

The Dems are going to lose seats, I have no doubt. But you seem to be living in a fantasy world. By this time next fall, the economy and markets will be in full speed ahead mode.

Obama will have accomplished most of his first two year goals, and you will be left looking like an idiot. As usual

Unconstitutional

LMAO

You are a fucking idiot.

it may very well be. but don't take my word for it. a number of legal scholars have posed that exact question recently.

Illegal Health Reform

But can Congress require every American to buy health insurance?

In short, no. The Constitution assigns only limited, enumerated powers to Congress and none, including the power to regulate interstate commerce or to impose taxes, would support a federal mandate requiring anyone who is otherwise without health insurance to buy it.

This leaves mandate supporters with few palatable options. Congress could attempt to condition some federal benefit on the acquisition of insurance. States, for example, usually condition issuance of a car registration on proof of automobile insurance, or on a sizable payment into an uninsured motorist fund. Even this, however, cannot achieve universal health coverage. No federal program or entitlement applies to the entire population, and it is difficult to conceive of a "benefit" that some part of the population would not choose to eschew.

The other obvious alternative is to use Congress's power to tax and spend. In an effort, perhaps, to anchor this mandate in that power, the Senate version of the individual mandate envisions that failure to comply would be met with a penalty, to be collected by the IRS. This arrangement, however, is not constitutional either.

Unconstitutional

I love that delusion.

Almost as good as harry's projection that the Republicans would retake the senate next year.

PRICELESS

I've heard lawyers, conservative lawyers, tell idiots like you rat, that your dreams of claiming health care reform will be unconstitutional as a pipe dream.

produce one.

like i just did to argue my perspective.

or are you LYING AGAIN???

LMAO..

Neither the Supreme Court, nor the lower courts, as they are now constituted, will overturn health reform on that basis.

What a maroon.

We are REQUIRED to purchase auto insurance. The same argument has been made, and tossed aside like Oily Taitz's birther arguments.

just as i thought.

you're lying again.

We are REQUIRED to purchase auto insurance

we are required to purchase auto insurance to protect against third party claims, not our own personal propoerty or our own health.

i think the term unconstitutional is rather fluid, it depends on the makeup of the court at the moment in time.

you could say to the gop, take it to the court, you have the conservative votes, you don't need the liberals to get it done!

Scottie, the same argument can be made in regards to requiring health insurance. The bills from the uninsured end up being on the tax payer dime.

Rat is whistling dixie.

Not only that, if this specious argument gets to the SCOTUS, it is likely that Obama will have had a chance to appoint at least one more associate justice, if not more.

The courts are highly unlikely to overturn reform on such grounds. Highly unlikely.

the same argument can be made in regards to requiring health insurance.

not really, there again the pool was created to protect third parties, you pay in, but you can benefit if you are involved in an accident with an unisured.

and if obama replaces a justice, it would probably be a liberal for a liberal, eg ginsburg.

this bill has a long way to go, they should remember to not do any more harm.

If rat read Article One of the Constitution, he would realize that

"Congress has the power to “lay and collect taxes, duties, imposts and excises” and to “provide for….the general welfare of the United States.” Rather than itemizing specific subject matters, such as health care, which Congress is allowed to spend money on, the framers chose instead to give Congress a broad mandate to spend money in ways that promote the “general welfare.”

He's living in a fantasy world.

Good morning.

Hey - don't you guys think the payroll taxes would have abolished long ago if the Constitution were really an issue?

It’s important to note just how radical Bachmann’s rat's theory of the Constitution is. If Congress does not have the power to create a modest public option which competes with private health plans in the marketplace, then it certainly does not have the authority to create Medicare. Similarly, Congress’ power to spend money to benefit the general welfare is the basis for Social Security, federal education funding, Medicaid, and veterans benefits such as the VA health system and the GI Bill. All of these programs would cease to exist in Michele Bachmann’s rat's America.

Filed Under:Healthe Care should be a constitutional right.

we are required to purchase auto insurance

It falls under the government's obligation of public safety.

The phony conservative concept that liberty is freedom to do anything we please without regard to others is flawed thinking based on selfishness.

Good morning JBD. As to taxes, payroll and income taxes, there are a lot of people in federal prison right now, who bought into this bogus line of reasoning. A quick google search will find you web sites that claim such taxes are illegal and unconstitutional.

IMO, if rat is so sure of that, he should immediately stop paying all his federal income taxes and withholding.

The only change we would see here, is he would be posting a lot less, as his time to use the prison library would cut way back on his time ability to post his rants and ravings!

this bill has a long way to go, they should remember to not do any more harm.

ha!

impossible since the dem asshats who are pushing this shitpile have taken the hypocritical oath:

buy the parasite vote with another welfare program, and who gives a shit how much harm you do and to whom, because 'you got yours.'


and the constitutionality of this is a very legitimate question.

IMO, if rat is so sure of that,

it's official.

you can't read.

i'm not sure. but the question is a legitimate one.

imbecile.

I don't think you have a leg to stand on. Article One gives congress a lot of leeway.

I searched for articles by lawyers that support your views, and guess what? They are few and far between, and based on the same arguments that were used by people who tried to overturn the New Deal.

They lost.

"Congress has the power to “lay and collect taxes, duties, imposts and excises” and to “provide for….the general welfare of the United States.”

that's nice.

and i seem to recall president alinsky telling, no, lecturing george stephanopolous that the fees and penalties are not a tax.

so which is it?

bho is an affirmative action grad from harvard law.

he should know.

I searched for articles by lawyers that support your views, and guess what? They are few and far between

you couldn't have searched too fucking hard. the opinions here run the gamut.

Filed Under:Rat's one sided interpretations.

the question is a legitimate one.

Start with the constitution. What does the preamble mean?

Define "promote the general welfare"

This argument has been going on for over 200 years.


Where in the Constitution were insurance companies given the right to profit from Health Care?

Give it your best shot rat.

You are delusional.

Medicare would be unconstitutional too.

Take that one to the SCOTUS and QUIT PAYING YOUR MEDICARE TAX IF YOU BELIEVE IT!

We will watch your trial on YouTube.

LMAO

Gamut?

LOL. one said it would be unconstitutional, the others all said, highly unlikely.

LOLOLOL

Define "promote the general welfare"

in today's terms it means that on the first of every month, every scumbag parasite in the nation peels their worthless ass off the couch and staggers out to the mailbox to pick up their gubmint check.

one said it would be unconstitutional

LOL.

wow.

you can't read and you can't count.

it's a good think you belong to a union or you would starve without their coddling.

Another 18 points and the Dow breaks10,000. k'putz will blame Obama.

I read the opinions. One said it was unconstitutional, the rest all said it is highly unlikely that it would ge overturned on those grounds.

Irony:

As Dear Leader and his merry band of marxists march towards socialism to ease the pain of recession (supposedly) Cuba turns to capitalism.

Define "promote the general welfare"

LOL, oh yeah, i almost forgot.

it also means that in a year when NYS is experiencing a $3B budget shortfall, our accidental democrat governor raises welfare benefits.


LMAO.

Another 18 points and the Dow breaks10,000.

yup.

another quarter of record profits bolstered by agressive cost cutting measures (LAYOFFS) and no incremental growth.

whee!!!


got stimulus???

got jobs???


LOL.


gosh, i'm feelin' all hopey and changey today!

Medicare would be unconstitutional too

Medicare was an attempt to help the poor so one could feasibly make a case for it under the general welfare clause.

Something you can't say for ObamoCare as it remands control of everyones health care choices.

Filed Under:Rat's self centered fear.

in today's terms it means...

The constitution was meant to be flexible to keep up with the times. Promoting the general welfare of the people.

You think survival of the fittest should be the norm. The rest of the civilized world don't.

What about the rights of corporations under the Constitution?

Another 18 points and the Dow breaks10,000.

Sweet. I'm getting a 16% return on my 401 as of yesterday.

I blame the fecklessness of traders for my fortune.

The literary luge ride down memory lane shoves off with a return to the economic collapse via former Treasury Secretary Hank Paulson’s “

“On the Brink: Inside the Race to Stop the Collapse of the Global Financial System,”

LMAO, a blast from the past to remind the Texas idiot that we would have had a world economic melt down, despite his well thunk out ideas that everything woulda been JUST fine if we let the banks collapse.

He would be selling apples on a street corner today, as his goldbricking ways would have gotten him fired.

it remands control of everyones health care choices.

Nice, two posts in and the lies start from the goldbrick.

k'putz will blame Obama.

And you'll of course credit Obama for it.

So what's the diff?

Lie?

I think not jackass.

BTW, hows work going today?

Still fucking off on your employers dime I see.

Filed Under:Harry's delusions.

remands control of everyones health care choices.

What choices are those Harry? Pay up, go bankrupt, or eat $hit and die?
You call them choices?

that we would have had a world economic melt down

By one of the chief dorkwads that was selling it?

LMAO!

It's irudite thinking just like that is the reason why your education didn't progress any further than your favorite bong dufus.

got stimulus???

got jobs???

Could it be we're headed for a jobless recovery that the dimbulbs of the reality based community harrangued Bush for for years?

Filed Under:Harry's selective memory.

obless recovery

Where did we here that before?
Oh yea...all the jobs that were supposed to be created by BushCo's tax breaks for those who create jobs.
What happened with hat Harry? Where did all that money go?

Time to debunk another lie.

..nearly eight months after its passage, a large majority of the stimulus has yet to start impacting the economy—as was the plan. And as was also the plan, the most visible parts of the stimulus are only taking effect now and will remain active through 2010. As you drive around town, it's difficult to visualize tax rebates or aid to states—the fast-acting components of the stimulus. But as I drive around my town today, I can see workers laboring at a $4 million, stimulus-backed road project that is just getting started and will run through the spring of 2011...the debate over whether the stimulus worked will ultimately be settled in 2012—as voters go to the polls and economists crunch the 2011 data. Until then, we should avoid jumping to rash conclusions.

You think survival of the fittest should be the norm.

as opposed to legislating everything to a least common denominator?

you betcha.

wink.

a large majority of the stimulus has yet to start impacting the economy—as was the plan.

because the plan really is to have the bulk of the $$$ kick in just as the 2010 re-election campaign season begins.

democrat party before country, an' shit.

Keep my daddy out of jail!!!!!!!!!!!

I’d reduce the real purpose of Keep America Safe to this: “Please don’t prosecute my father!” It’s increasingly clear that Dick Cheney was the author of the Bush-era torture policies, and my hunch is that when the Justice Department releases the OPR report on the torture memos, we’re going to find more evidence of the invisible hand of Dick Cheney behind the whole project. Any fair-minded federal prosecutor looking into the matter would shortly be preparing to do what Patrick Fitzgerald probably wishes now he had done: indict Dick Cheney.

Filed Under:Rat's phony preconceptions.

legislating everything to a least common denominator?

Who's proposing that?

Mandating for the general welfare is the government's job. There are too many people like you who don't want to pay their fair share.

Explain why unregulated free market capitalism is essential for American democracy.

because the plan really is to have the bulk of the $$$ kick in just as the 2010 re-election campaign season begins.

That's part of it, I am sure. That's how the game is played, and both sides have done it in the past. I am old enough to remember Richard Nixon pump-priming like crazy in front of his re-election campaign.

But also, you can't just dump money out there in a bucket and have everyone get free handfulls of cash.

That's why I laugh, laught out LOUD and your cocksure predictions of a HUGE Republican resurgence. You LIKE the anger and teabaggery, it fires up the wingnuts like YOU. But to the average voter, you look like a bunch of crazed weasels.

And.. you are.

a large majority of the stimulus has yet to start impacting the economy—as was the plan.

Then why was your Plastic Jesus and his minions, inlcuding the fucktards that layed out the Spendulus promising instant effects including hundreds of thousands of jobs within months of it's signing?

Remember you dork chortling retard that we were told we had to have the Porkulus immediately to fend of a Catastrophe of epic proportions. You know. Great Depression Part Deux?

It’s increasingly clear that Dick Cheney was the author of the Bush-era torture policies

Ain't that sorta a no brainer? Dumbya was too stupid to even manage opening a door.

But to the average voter, you look like a bunch of crazed weasels.

which explains why prezbo and congressional dems are losing indepepndents in the polls.

gotcha.

wink.

It’s increasingly clear that Dick Cheney was the author of the Bush-era torture policies, and my hunch is that when the Justice Department releases the OPR report on the torture memos, we’re going to find more evidence of the invisible hand of Dick Cheney behind the whole project.

Kinda like you nimrods were so positive that Cheney had a hand in .00Plamegate huh? Frogmarching old Cheney down the courthouse steps I think the rant was.

What bile for blood ignoramouses you netfruits are.

Once again we're going to laugh at you dolts weapons grade asshatery.

Great Depression Part Deux?

You are such an ass, really you are.

The stimulus was not part of the bank bailout, that started under Bush and continued under Obama. TARP is a completely separate progam from the stimulus plan.

Many, not all, but a majority of economists thought TARP was NECESSARY to avoid a total melt down of the global banking system and credit markets.

You, because you are an idiot, find a few who agree with you.

I mean, what kind of an ass, would take the risk of letting banks like CITI and B of A go down, threatening tot cause a casading world wide collapse?

YOU WOULD. But thank what ever power there is in this world, assholes like YOU did not make that decision.

Goldbricking moron.

Filed Under:Look in the mirror rat.

democrat party before country, an' shit.

You mean like forcing a vote on Iraq just before an election?
Or questioning combat veterans patriotism?
What about now? Trying to block needed health insurance reform or anything else just to paint the president as a failure?

your cocksure predictions of a HUGE Republican resurgence

The likes of Nate Silver and Roger Cook will be surprised to learn they're crazed weasels.

Pull your head out of your ass and take a gulp of fresh air twinkle toes.

Remember you dork chortling retard that we were told we had to have the Porkulus immediately to fend of a Catastrophe of epic proportions. You know. Great Depression Part Deux?

paul "i used to work for enron" krugman is still beating that drum.

LOL

That's part of it, I am sure.

no, that's all of it.

i'm sure.

you shitstains only care about one thing - buying votes.

Filed Under:Rat debates reality.

krugman is still beating that drum.

Maybe because it's true?
Without the government pumping in capital, the economy would be in a depression.
Where is all the job creation from the BushCo tax cuts?

you shitstains only care about one thing - buying votes.

Yawn, more over the top, b.s.

One of these days, perhaps you will find it within your meager abilities to actually debate something instead of spouting over the top rhetoric that is patently bullshit.

But I won't hold my breath waiting on that to happen.

president alinsky is a liability in new jersey.

One of these days, perhaps you will find it within your meager abilities to actually debate something

oh, the irony!!!

pot, meet kettle.


LMAO.

The stimulus was not part of the bank bailout, that started under Bush and continued under Obama. TARP is a completely separate progam from the stimulus plan.

Stop dancing you insipid moron.

You know fucking damn well your messiah was couching the passage of the Porkulus in apocolyptic terms as in catastrophic and gravity as in the great depression.

And BTW there's only one thing worse than being a goldbricker and that's goldbricker who doesn't have the gnads to admit he's doing the same thing.

But then again, that's why God created hypocritical douchenozzleslike halfadick anyway.

9,994.62
I guess the phony conservatives want the stock market to collapse so they can blame Obama.

you shitstains only care about one thing - buying votes.

And power grabs.

And sending the US on the proverbial high speed train to euroweenie mediocrity.

Filed Under:Rat never answers a question.

pot, meet kettle.

What rights do corporations have under the constitution?
Why is unregulated free market capitalism essential to American democracy?

Why do you want America to fail just so you can blame Obama?

One of these days, perhaps you will find it within your meager abilities to actually debate something

That'll come a lot sooner than the day you can formulate a thought on your own dickhead.


Mr Sandbagging IQ "in the 140's".

LMFAO!!

Dow hits 10,000

The Dow briefly traded above 10,000 today for the first time in over a year. The Dow rose to 10,001.58, then fell back slightly. The last time the Dow crossed 10,000 during a trading session was October 7, 2008, when it briefly touched 10,124.03. CNNMoney reports the bump in stocks came after better-than-expected quarterly profit reports from Intel and JPMorgan Chase.

Republicans give the credit to Saint Ronald Reagan.

I guess the phony conservatives want the stock market to collapse so they can blame Obama.

give me a reason to credit prezbo for dow 10,000 like reducing cap gains or copr taxes and i'll give him the credit he would be due with such bold, economy-driving moves.

for those not paying attention, dow 10,000 is based upon record profits derived from drastic cost-cutting meaures (LAYOFFS), not top-line growth.

so if you want me to give bho credit for 9.8% unemployment (official), or 17% unemployment (actual), i'm ok wit dat.

INSTANT VIEW: Dow hits 10,000 for first time in a year

The 10,000 figure is seen by some as a sign that the market's recovery may endure. The Dow is now nearly 55 percent higher than the 12-year-low of 6469.95 hit on March 6, but remains more than 12 percent from its pre-Lehman Brothers bankruptcy close on September 12, 2008.

You are a liar,as usual.

FYI, my IQ has tested repeatedly, since grade school, at 135, at least 30 points higher than yours.

Not a genius, can't join MENSA, and don't want to.

And like everyone else, I have strenths and weakenesses. I have a far better than average memory and recall. But have trouble understanding some math concepts and in fact, had trouble with math, because I had a am a "global thinker" as it is called. As you learn math in stages, from arithmatic into algebra and beyond, I had a tough time of it.

I also have pretty good three dimensional thinking abilities, making my current job that involves reading construction documents easier than it is for others.

But 140's, never claimed it.

Now eat shit and bark at the moon, asshole.

Smart Power!

After giving away eastern europes long planned missile defense system to ingratiate themselves to Russia in hopes of getting them to get tough with Irans nuclear program Putin has responded:

Fuck you dumbasses!.

Republicans give the credit to Saint Ronald Reagan.

Where?

And sending the US on the proverbial high speed train to euroweenie mediocrity.

indeed.

no wonder the euro-weenies love us again. we're heading straight into the abyss of socialism. to join them.

and as consolation, president alinsky gets the noble appease prize.

whee!!!



LOL.

Fuck you dumbasses!.

Clinton failed to secure any specific assurances from Russia on Iran during her visit, leaving her open to criticism at home that she had not received anything from Moscow after earlier U.S. concessions on missile defence.


LOL.

this will not end well.

Reducing taxes is not the only way to stimulate economic growth.

That is a Republican myth.

One of many.

I also have pretty good three dimensional thinking abilities

which means you can be a fuckwit, a douchebag, and a moron...


...all at the same time.

But 140's, never claimed it.

Another breath, another lie.

Of course you did dumbfuck. We all saw it and knew it for the bullshit lie it was. Just like you're "135" and "tested repeatedly" crap. That's wh you count shit like paperclips and whatnot for a living.

I can understand why you may not remember though. Clearly it's tough keeping all the lies in line. Even for a genius like you. LOL!

Whatta narcissistic douche you are halfwit. Got any new pictures of yourself in your wallet?

Reducing taxes is not the only way to stimulate economic growth.

That is a Republican myth.

One of many.

no shit???

THAT explains why JFK did it and it worked so goddamned well.


put your global thinking cap on, will ya?

LOL.

Filed Under:More questions for Rat

reducing cap gains or copr taxes

Where are all the jobs created by BushCo's doing that?

Why is it better to spend 17% GDP so insurance companies can make a profit and let people go bankrupt and/or die?

I also have pretty good three dimensional thinking abilities, making my current job that involves reading construction documents easier than it is for others.

Gee, just like those not so genius contruction guys who, you know, construct shit from those construction drawings.

LMFAO! Who knew halfwit could bend over and suck his own dick!

Whatta retard!

The Pentagon says it has just finished the best recruiting year since the all-volunteer military was established in 1973.

Defense Department head of personnel Bill Carr says all services met their goals for active duty and reserve recruiting and that the quality of recruits improved during the budget year that ended Sept. 30.

my IQ has tested repeatedly, since grade school, at 135, at least 30 points higher than yours.

Not a genius, can't join MENSA, and don't want to.

would you like an application to DENSA?

..;>))..........

Reducing taxes is not the only way to stimulate economic growth.

But of course out of control government spending and raising taxes in a recession does?

Do you eat paint chips for breakfast everyday?

Filed Under:Rat's strawman arguments.

why JFK did it

When Kennedy came into office in 1961, the top marginal rate of individual income tax was 91%, compared with 39.6% today. The top corporate rate was 52%.

Today the rich pay around 28% of what they can't hide and corporations about 6%.
WHERE ARE ALL THE JOBS CREATED BY ALL THIS TAX CUTTING BY THE REPUBLICONS?!?

Clinton raised taxes in 1992 and we saw the longest, sustained expansion of our economy in history.

Bush fucked that up.

Exchange of the Day

Robert Gibbs is in super-spin mode on stimulus jobs. You see, the states only report the guy hired to build the road, while the White House wants to count the guy who sold the guy who builds the road a Coke in its job figures. The White House calls that the "multiplier" effect:

Q Robert, two weeks ago in a conference call with the nation's governors, Vice President Biden mentioned that he was concerned and they expressed their concerns that the job figures that they'll report on the stimulus will be significantly lower than what the administration has already said was created.

MR. GIBBS: I think part of that is — as I understand it, the reports themselves do not count a multiplier effect for jobs, which —

Q Right. The states have to report auditable jobs only.

MR. GIBBS: Right, that when we obviously know that in order to pave a road it's not the person paving the road. Somebody has got to make the pavement. Somebody makes those orange cones so we don't crash into the people paving the road. So, you know, we feel comfortable with our estimates.

Q Well, the Vice President doesn't, because he used the term "mouse-trapped" when he talked about how the administration and the states could be captured by this discrepancy in the figures. So I want to ask, how did the White House get itself into this box, given that jobs creation should be enough to be the key part of a partisan debate on —

MR. GIBBS: I don't think — I don't think what the Vice President is saying is different than what I'm saying. There are different measures for different things. We feel very comfortable that the estimates that have been made are completely accurate. These reports measure something different than that. It's just two different measurements. But we feel comfortable with where we are.

Q Is that number one million jobs saved or created?

MR. GIBBS: That's whatever the CEA last reported to you guys.

Q Well, it's what I believe Vice President Biden said last week. So you stand by that?

MR. GIBBS: Everybody does, yes.

Q States don't, though. They will report less.

MR. GIBBS: Again, because they're not reporting multiplied jobs, right? So let's say — well, I won't use that example, that will just get me in trouble. I'll go back to my example —

Q Come on.

MR. GIBBS: No, no, no, no, no —

Q Come on. (Laughter.)

MR. GIBBS: No, no, no, no — no, no, no, no — (laughter.) The angel won, the devil lost.

No, no, again — again, go back to my example. Go into the example of virtually everything that if you're creating jobs for clean energy jobs, there is a process along the way. There's many different components, not all of which are measured in these reports. That's — what I'm telling you is —

Q But would there have been a way to resolve the discrepancy that will emerge when these reports come in on Thursday?

MR. GIBBS: We're not worried about whatever discrepancy it is you're trying to make into a much bigger story.

Filed Under:the tax cut myth.
When Kennedy came into office in 1961, the top marginal rate of individual income tax was 91%
And the economy was boooooming!
Tax rates don't mean $hit.

Clinton failed to secure any specific assurances from Russia on Iran during her visit, leaving her open to criticism at home that she had not received anything from Moscow after earlier U.S. concessions on missile defence.

stange way obama has decided to negotiate with russia.

i never thought that giving away tat would get you any tit.

Robert Gibbs is in super-spin mode on stimulus jobs.

Speaking of spokestools and spinning, did you see what that dolt said yesterday concerning Snowes inevitable vote with the dems on the senate bill
14-9)?

He called it bypartisan. 1 out of 10 is now bypartisan.

LOL!

CHT's Geniuses.

Over the first seven weeks of the Obama presidency, the Dow Jones Industrial Average, just one of many Wall Street indexes, dropped from 7,949.08 to 6,547.04. A wide variety of conservatives said this was necessarily evidence that the White House's economic policies were a mess, if not an outright failure, and that the president didn't know what he was doing. The Wall Street Journal ran an entire editorial on this in early March. The drop in the Dow, the WSJ insisted, was a direct result of investors evaluating "Mr. Obama's agenda and his approach to governance."

Karl Rove and Lou Dobbs made the same case. So did Rush Limbaugh, Sean Hannity, rat, several other of the CHT right wing idiotsphere and Fred Barnes. It was one of Mitt Romney's favorite talking points for a while, too.

I don't buy the spin that changing the strategy on missle defense was a 'concession' to Russia. It was a logical, military decision to change strategy. And it had the unanimous support of the Joint Chiefs.

i never thought that giving away tat would get you any tit.

Not unless tat has a picture of Andrew Jackson on it.

Then again, the way things are going that might be enough either.

BTW, too bad about the SOX.

Clinton raised taxes in 1992 and we saw the longest, sustained expansion of our economy in history.

So are you seriously saying Clintons tax increase was the reason for that expanded economy?

Please say it is so we can laugh at your rank stupidity even more.

don't buy the spin that changing the strategy on missle defense was a 'concession' to Russia.

Of course you wouldn't.

You're The Ones chief toe sucker on CHT.

I don't buy the spin that changing the strategy on missle defense was a 'concession' to Russia. It was a logical, military decision to change strategy.

it was something we decided we could give up. that does not mena you give it up before you sit down at the table.

He called it bypartisan. 1 out of 10 is now bypartisan.

LOL.

it sounds like something yogi berra would say -

"Baseball is ninety percent mental and the other half is physical."

too bad about the SOX.

as well as they did during the regular season they were a flawed team. they have no power at the corners or 2/3 of their outfield. no bat off the bench.

I don't buy the spin that changing the strategy on missle defense was a 'concession' to Russia. It was a logical, military decision to change strategy. And it had the unanimous support of the Joint Chiefs.

of course it was. and of course the JC's went along.

and now josef putin is telling bho to go fuck himself. and to leave iran alone.

boy, that nobel appease prize was truly visionary.

LOL.

BTW, too bad about the SOX.

yeah, i second that.

but not that bad.

So are you seriously saying Clintons tax increase was the reason for that expanded economy?

you take that one harry.

i can't get involved when hackbaked goes "full retard."

LOL.

OT: FREEWAY SERIES!

it was something we decided we could give up. that does not mena (s9c) you give it up before you sit down at the table.

I will give you that point. But the right winger spin from these two geniuses ain't nothing but partisan bullshit.

Besides, this stuff is not done in tune with the 24/7 news cycle. Diplomacy is a long term kibuki dance and the real results are not yet known.

The Russians are in this for the Russians, not the Americans. I strongly doubt that if we had waited until the conclusion of this meeting to make the strategic changes being made, the outcome would be different.

The right wing idjits here are just that, idjits.

Hehe.. did anyone else see, Glenn Beck claims the 'persecution' of Fox "News" is comparable to the holocaust?

Geebus

Republican National Committee chair Michael Steele, asked on Thursday whether his party would have to jump on the health care reform "train", responded that he was a cow on the tracks trying to stop it.

LMAO

Can he get any more pathetic?

Filed Under:Phony Pflip Pflopps.

Clintons tax increase was the reason for that expanded economy?

It's just as credible as "tax cuts create economic growth".
Where's the beef?
Where are all the good jobs that where supposed to be created by BushCo's tax cuts?

In a way, Clinton's tax increases DID pave the way for the economic growth of the 90's. By getting the deficit under control and keeping inflation down, he enabled Greenspan to keep interest rates low.

Now yeah, the housing bubble that finally burst also helped, it put a lot of what turned out to be artificial money into the system.

But thern along came Bush. He both increased spending AND cut taxes.

And so in this case, CHTID has a point.

Where ARE those good jobs promised by Bush when he got his tax cuts passed, anyhow??

Hehe. and yeah, the Dow at 10,000 is largely symbolic, but when it was at 6,500 rat said it was ALL due to the election of Barack Obama.

I laughed at him then and have the last laugh now.

Buwahahahahahahahahhhahahahaha

i agree that a major driver for the economic expansion during the clinton years was a determination to get the deficits under control. this freed up the debt markets and allowed more corporate and project borrowing at single digit interest rates.

cutting taxes and not cutting spending as w and now obama are doing, is not going to lead to sustained growth.

Irony of ironies:

Clinton and Edwards health care reform speechwriter moves to state that has the type of universal health care liberals get orgasmic about and finds out she can no longer afford insurance.

How could all of these weeks and months go by and no one is examining and talking about what has worked and what hasn't worked in Massachusetts?

BINGO

By getting the deficit under control and keeping inflation down, he enabled Greenspan to keep interest rates low.

Except Clintons only credit in that was His Horndogship signing onto the bills the GOP controlled legislature practically had to force down his throat.

Where ARE those good jobs promised by Bush when he got his tax cuts passed, anyhow??

The same place Dear Leaders promised good jobs went when he got his Porkulus passed?

BINGO

Indeed. But she knows the answer to that.

Someone else pay for this bill - NOT US, say unions etal...

"WASHINGTON — Insurance companies, unions and other special interest groups pushed back hard Wednesday against health care legislation that could cost their members billions of dollars.

If they succeed in shifting the proposed taxes away from them, then Congress and the Obama administration will have all the more difficulty paying for the roughly $900 billion, 10-year plan.

A full-page newspaper ad by labor unions, and an insurance industry TV ad aimed at elderly Americans, are the latest efforts by major groups to transfer burdens to someone else — anyone else." link

Can he get any more pathetic?

Oh yes he can!

See his "Wat up" page on the web?

That's pretty pathetic.

Of course when they (GOP) dump that smelly turd there'll be allegations of racism.

Whatta FUBAR.

Where ARE those good jobs promised by Bush when he got his tax cuts passed, anyhow??

His (actually the FED's) weak dollar policy subjugated any potential for job growth. They were all moved overseas chasing stronger currency. That's why the tax cuts didn't have the full effect they should have for job growth

Hehe.. did anyone else see, Glenn Beck claims the 'persecution' of Fox "News" is comparable to the holocaust?

no i didn't. but if it's good enough for an asshat like grayson, it's good enough for beck.

but when it was at 6,500 rat said it was ALL due to the election of Barack Obama.

check the dow chart.

it sank like a fucking stone starting on election day.

They Just Don’t Learn

Perceived crisis can make for very bad judgment, and nowhere is that eternal truth more prominent than inside the Beltway. With the arrival of The One and absolute Democratic control of Congress, the groups that provide actual health care and insurance services — the doctors, the hospitals, the producers of drugs and devices, the insurers — knew that the thieves would view them, Willie Hutton–style, as the places where the money is to be found. And so they began to run around in circles like a guy whose mistress was in the bathroom when his wife came home a day early from a visit to her mother...

Dhimms worried not having a black candidate on the ballot is going to equate to blacks not showing up to the polls to help Democrats.

Sayeth one crazed weasel who just happens to also be a Democrat pollster:

Tom Jensen, a spokesman for the Democratic-leaning Public Policy Polling, has been among the most outspoken. He said the high number of Democrats with districts that are significantly black means such a turnout shift could be disastrous for Democrats.

If what looks like is going to happen in Virginia plays out on a national level, I do think Democrats will lose the House,” Jensen said.

But that can't be true because CHTs most accurate (1 for 4) predicter of elections results since 2000 says it's just crazy weasel talking to think the GOP is going to takeover anything. After all, according to this sage of the foot kissers, the GOP is on their way to obscurity for the next couple of decades at least.

And so they began to run around in circles like a guy whose mistress was in the bathroom when his wife came home a day early from a visit to her mother...

I think a better analogy would be the guy who had full faith in his wifes vows and came home early from work to catch his not so loving wife in the bathroom with the pool guy.

And if they're like most men who aren't confused metrosexuals like libtards generally seem to be, they'll shake off the betrayal of Dear Leader and his false promises, pick up a shotgun and start shooting at anything that moves.

some people learn from their life experiences. And this one deeply, deeply disagrees with the brilliant "economists" like rat and harry on CHT.

I remain incredulous that serious economists not only opposed TARP, but also argued that tax cuts were the only fiscal stimulus the government should have engaged in--if it did anything at all. (I explain my opposition to the do-nothing crowd here.) I really don't understand how tax cuts would have done the slightest bit of good when millions of people had no income because they were unemployed, when businesses had no profits to tax, and investors had huge capital losses that will offset all of their gains for years to come. Given such economic conditions--resulting from a lack of demand, not supply--it's nonsensical to think that tax cuts would have helped. Indeed, one can make a case that the tax cuts included in the stimulus bill were its least effective element.

Many of my friends believe I have abandoned supply side economics and become a Keynesian. (Among conservatives there are few insults more damning than to be labeled a "Keynesian.") But as I try to explain in my book, my views haven't changed at all; it's circumstances that have changed. I believe that my friends are still stuck in the 1970s when tax rates were considerably higher and excessive demand (i.e., inflation) was our biggest economic problem. Today, tax rates are much lower and a lack of demand (i.e., deflation) is the central problem. I really don't understand why conservatives insist on a one-size-fits-all economic policy consisting of more and bigger tax cuts no matter what the economic circumstances are; it's simply become dogma totally disconnected from reality.

Nor do I understand the conservative antipathy for Keynes, who was in fact deeply conservative. He developed his theories primarily for the purpose of saving capitalism from some form of socialism. Same goes for Franklin D. Roosevelt, whose biggest economic mistake, I believe, was not that he ran big budget deficits, as all conservatives believe, but that he didn't run deficits nearly large enough until the war forced his hand. (I discuss these points in columns here and here.)

People can judge for themselves if I prove my case. But whether they agree or disagree, I think they will learn something useful from reading my book. I learned a lot from writing it.

People can judge for themselves if I prove my case. But whether they agree or disagree, I think they will learn something useful from reading my book. I learned a lot from writing it.

ah, so when all is said and done, the rant is about hawking a book.

LOL.

And if they're like most men who aren't confused metrosexuals like libtards generally seem to be, they'll shake off the betrayal of Dear Leader and his false promises, pick up a shotgun and start shooting at anything that moves.

uh oh, now you did it harry.

hackbaked is gonna call bho's SS on ya.

LOL.

He said the high number of Democrats with districts that are significantly black means such a turnout shift could be disastrous for Democrats.

is he saying that they can't get their fat asses off the couch to vote unless the candidate is black???

why, that's racist!!!

LOL! Bruce Bartlett.

I should have known you'd come up with another faux conservative in an effort to put lipstick on your asshattery.

why, that's racist!!!

So is blacks voting for no reason other than skin color but we're not allowed to say shit like that.

So is blacks voting for no reason other than skin color but we're not allowed to say shit like that.

...an' shit.

Yes he wrote a book and yes he has learned from experience that what worked once may not work when circumstances change.

Something you stupid whacks and hacks will never,ever figure out.

You fucking morons. Marginal rates are about as low as they can go now. When they went from 90% to 70% to 35% eventually, tax cuts alone could have positive affects on the economy. BUT those days are OVER, you thick skulled morons, and at least Bartlett is smart enough to undertand.

HE AUTHORED Reagan's tax cuts, asshole.

He's not a faux conservative, what he is, unlike you whackos, a smart one.

LMAO, the whacks at "The Corner" want David Patraeus to run against Obama in 2012.

BRILLIANT!

HE AUTHORED Reagan's tax cuts, asshole.

not quite. he had some influence on the policies, but it can hardly be said he authored them.

art laffer had much more influence over reagan's tax policies with his simple yet alarmingly accurate curve.

but of course you dismiss laffer as a hack because he didn't write a book highly critical of bush 43.

your ass-hackery knows no bounds.

Clown Hall Strikes Again!

Whata jackass..

"So yes, I hate Obama's America. Because Obama's America isn't America -- it's the European view of America, implemented from high office. Opposing the total redefinition of America isn't anti-American; it's patriotic. And opposing those, like Obama, who push for that drastic redefinition, isn't "hating America" -- it's fighting in favor of the America that ended slavery, built the greatest economic empire in world history and liberated tens of millions around the globe,"

He would fit in right in here, with this ODS infested, anti-american assholes.

LMAO, the whacks at "The Corner" want David Patraeus to run against Obama in 2012.

BRILLIANT!

it could very well be smart, if not brilliant.

let's see the dems attack petreus.

the last time it didn't work out so well.

in fact, i think they were betrayed by their zeal.

LOL.

Again hack rat, circumstances CHANGE over time, and you are just too fucking block headed to see it.

You keep hitting your hand with a hammer, because it feels SO good when you stop doing it.

Then repeat.

ad nauseum.

More insanity from Obama. Why don't we give the weapons to Russia so they can destroy us? Obama is a tool for Putin.

Russia and the United States have tentatively agreed to a weapons inspection program that would allow Russians to visit nuclear sites in America to count missiles and warheads.

The plan, which Fox News has learned was agreed to in principle during negotiations, would constitute the most intrusive weapons inspection program the U.S. has ever accepted.

Foreign Minister Sergey Lavrov, who met with Secretary of State Hillary Clinton, said publicly Tuesday that the two nations have made "considerable" progress toward reaching agreement on a new strategic arms treaty.

The 1991 Strategic Arms Reduction Treaty, or START, expires in December and negotiators have been racing to reach agreement on a successor.

Clinton said the U.S. would be as transparent as possible.

He would fit in right in here, with this ODS infested, anti-american assholes.

Another pot call the kettle black moment for Halfwit. He has said that an much worst a Bush. Hypocrisy reigns supreme in Halfwits world.

Obama Touts Transportation Stimulus in State That Has Spent Least

To tout the benefits of the stimulus package, President Obama traveled to Fairfax, Virginia, today. Earlier this month, House Transportation Committee Jim Oberstar observed that the "state ranks last among all states (51 out of 51), based on an analysis of the percentage of Recovery Act highway formula funds put out to bid, under contract and under way."

Oh, you know who wasn't there? Creigh Deeds, the Democrat running for governor, who's been lamenting "what's going on in Washington" lately.

There are a million reasons why it would be a disaster, less so for Obama than you would think.

Patraeus would have to resign and publicly say his CiC caused him to fail. He would then have to do politics. Generals don't have much history of success in politics. And I would bet that far more of the leadership of the Pentagon would be against it than would be for it. It would in effect, be a betrayal of the concept of civilian control of the military.

Now I know authoritarian, right wing jingoistic assholes like you, who really are anti-american, would be all for it. True patriots would be aghast.

Again hack rat, circumstances CHANGE over time, and you are just too fucking block headed to see it.

indeed they do. and the circumstances that are changing of late is president alinsky and the dems losing support of indy voters.

so how would you guys attack petreus...

...this time?


my willing suspension of disbelief anxiously awaits your response.

R.I.P. Captain Lou Albano

Generals don't have much history of success in politics.

LMAO.

shall we start with george washington himself?

how about ike?

powell? he had a ton of people wishing him to run in 2000. i was among them.

you fucking assclown.

you obviously do not want to be taken even the least bit seriously around here anymore.

Two generals, two, have been elected President, asshole.

Grant, known by history as a failure, and Eisenhower, that's IT.

Even MacAurthur would not go that route, and neither will Patraeus.

It would in effect, be a betrayal of the concept of civilian control of the military.

you do realize that if he were to win, he resigns from the military. knowing petreus, he would resign before declaring himself a candidate.

True patriots would be aghast.

ok, just so i got this straight, when jon fucktard carry was running, we were reminded of his vietnam service, oh, about every 5 minutes. you know, reporting for doodie at the dnc and all that.

and now in a blatant and disgustingly hypocritical about-face, it would be unpatriotic for petreus to run???

And of course, Washington, who strongly supported civilian supremacy over the military.

You don't, you would prefer a military dictatorship. It fits your belief system.



btw, you stupid hack, no one takes anything you say seriously, because your total insanity has been evident for a long, long time.

The late 19th century was full of ex civil war army officers who became president starting with US Grant and ending with McKinley.

Yes, for Patraeus, who is now CENTCOM commander for this administration, to resign, attack the President and run for that office, would be deeply unpatriotic and a supreme danger to the constitution itself.

So naturally, you think it's a fine idea.

Two generals, two, have been elected President, asshole.

Grant, known by history as a failure, and Eisenhower, that's IT.

andrew jackson as a major general don't count, eh?

The late 19th century was full of ex civil war army officers who became president starting with US Grant and ending with McKinley.

True enough, but.. and it's a huge difference, they did not resign, do what the cornerites at the NRO want Patraeus to do, deeply undermining civilian control of the military.

I knew you guys would be all for it.

Anti-american assholes that you are.

Yes, for Patraeus, who is now CENTCOM commander for this administration, to resign, attack the President and run for that office, would be deeply unpatriotic and a supreme danger to the constitution itself.

LOL.

please, please, please elaborate.

this i gotta see.

Two generals, two, have been elected President, asshole.

Rutherford B Hays was a Major General during the civil war. So was James Garfield.

And of course, George Washington was commanding general of the revolutionary army.

John Tyler was a general too.

Petraeus is registered to vote as a Republican in New Hampshire—he once described himself to a friend as a northeastern Republican, in the tradition of Nelson Rockefeller—but he said that around 2002, after he became a two-star general, he stopped voting.

LOL, rat would never support him anyhow, he would call him a RINO!


L
M
F
A
O

John Tyler was a general too.

nicely done, cs.

and gee, it turns out there was a whole bunch of 'em.

so whattaya think?

is hackbaked a fucking liar or just a fucking moron?

and yes, he can be both if you wish.

LOL.

Yes, for Patraeus, who is now CENTCOM commander for this administration

CENTCON is usually the terminal rank and billit in an Army Career. He will retire when his hitch there is up. Just in time to run for president if he so chooses.

is hackbaked a fucking liar or just a fucking moron?

Why does it have to be either/or ?

Petraeus is registered to vote as a Republican in New Hampshire—he once described himself to a friend as a northeastern Republican, in the tradition of Nelson Rockefeller—but he said that around 2002, after he became a two-star general, he stopped voting.

wow. that's a pretty damning indictment ya got there. the next thing you'll tell me is that the man pumps his own gas and prefers bud light.

and the new yorker, no less.

that's sly hersh's favorite rag haunt isn't it?

LOL.

I strongly believe rat, that to have the Central Command general resign, blame the President and then run for the office, would put the very concept of civilian authority over the military in jeapordy. If he's unhappy or uncomfortable with what he is being ordered to do, he can do what, with few exceptions, McClellan was one, did.

Retired and faded slowly, slowly away.

It's nothing more than cornerite whack job over the water cooler speculation anyhow, because despite the desire among the right in this country to de-legitimize Obama and install in effect, a military dictator, it ain't gonna happen. Patraeus would never let himself get used like that. As I said earlier, even MacAurthur knew better.

Why is it that the Republicans, every time a Democrat gets elected, has a "Seven Days in May" fantasy?

Hehe. and yeah, the Dow at 10,000 is largely symbolic, but when it was at 6,500 rat said it was ALL due to the election of Barack

Cavuto: Since Obama Blames Bush for Economy, Does Bush Get Credit for Dow 10K?

Filed Under:Whatta bunch of bull$hit!
RE:Where are the jobs created by BushCo tax cuts?

His (actually the FED's) weak dollar policy subjugated any potential for job growth. They were all moved overseas chasing stronger currency. That's why the tax cuts didn't have the full effect they should have for job growth

Where do you get this trickle down econobabble from?
They went over seas because of the cheap labor! The Fed kept the interest rates too low creating Bush's bubble economy. Taxes had nothing to do with it.
The only things BushCo's tax cuts did was increase the defecit and make the rich richer.

Lottery winner helps the poor.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UMfxuKyE-8I&hl=en&fs=1&rel=0

Hehe. and yeah, the Dow at 10,000 is largely symbolic

Symbolic of a weakened dollar - thanks to Obama's spending.

Darrell M. West, Vice President, Governance Studies, Brookings:

The rise of the Dow to above 10,000 should scare the heck out of Republicans. The market is forecasting the economy will be stronger in six months. What is the GOP strategy for 2010 going to be in there is an economic recovery?

My answer: Healthcare, Afghanistan, neither of which will work.

So he's not an economist but he plays one and jimmy falls for it. lol

Darrell M. West is the vice president and director of Governance Studies at Brookings. His studies include campaigns and elections, political advertising, mass media, public opinion, technology policy and electronic government.

Even his Wicki article gives him pretty impressive credentials.
You've long made it clear what YOU'RE falling for.

WHODA THUNK IT?

So much for that talking point: Just
15% of Americans think we have the best health care in the world... http://pwire.us/E0
--twitter on Political Wire

Wicki article gives him pretty impressive credentials.

what Poli-sci, poli-sci and poli-sci?

lmao

AND IT GETS EVEN WORSE

Poll: ONLY 28% OF REPUBLICANS BELIEVE AMERICAN HEALTH CARE BEST IN WORLD

Others have already taken a crack at this new Pew poll on American attitudes towards our health care system. But I wanted to highlight the number bolded below — the percentage of Republicans who believe the GOP talking point that American health care is the best in the world:

According to Americans the United States does not have the best health care in the world. Most see our health care as average (32%) or below average (27%) when compared with health care in other industrialized countries. Only 15% support the often-used political talking point that America has the best health care in the world; 23% say it is above average. Republicans (28%) are far more likely than Democrats (9%) or independents (12%) to say American health care is the best in the world, and conservative Republicans are even more pro American health care (66% say it is the best in the world or above average).

It’s true that the number of Republicans who believe this is higher than the number of Dems or independents who believe it. Still, is it not striking that fewer than a third of Repubicans embraces one of the leading talking points employed by GOP leaders?
...THE DAMNING ARTICLE CONTINUES...

Filed Under:The failure of REAGANISM

WASHINGTON – The number of households caught up in the foreclosure crisis rose more than 5 percent from summer to fall as a federal effort to assist struggling borrowers was overwhelmed by a flood of defaults among people who lost their jobs.

No job.
No home.
No health insurance.

Rich people have their tax cuts though.
Nice country.

Filed Under:The failure of REAGANISM

REfiled Under: Obama is President, not Reagan

They went over seas because of the cheap labor! The Fed kept the interest rates too low creating Bush's bubble economy. Taxes had nothing to do with it.

Filed Under: cht in denial failed economics

The cheap dollars you mention create what is called a "carry trade". Corps borrowed cheap dollars and built foreign factories with cheap dollars, moving the jobs overseas...while reaping the rewards of stronger foreign currencies at the expense of the cheap dollar and US jobs.

Filed Under:Whatta bunch of voodo economics.

cheap dollars, moving the jobs overseas..

DOLLARS ARE NOT CHEAP! China keeps it's currency artificially low so dollars are worth more to keep their labor cheap.
The "carry trade" has nothing to do with that.
We keep issuing debt and they send us the junk to buy with it.
WHEN they decide to stop buying our debt, than the value of the dollar will drop.

Why do you defend the Actor/Soap salesman who promoted cheap labor capitalism?
TRICKLE DOWN.....my a$$!

Filed Under:Whatta sick bastard.

Obama is President, not Reagan

30 years of REAGANISM destroyed the middle class in America.
Obama had nothing to do with that.

Obama didn't waste blood and treasure in Iraq AND lower taxes at the same time. George, son of god Reagan, did!

Filed Under:The FAILURE of Reaganomics.
Reaganomics (a portmanteau of Reagan and economics attributed to Paul Harvey refers to the economic policies promoted by United States President Ronald Reagan during the 1980s. The four pillars of Reagan's economic policy were to:reduce the growth of government spending, how did that work out?
reduce income and capital gains marginal tax rates, great if you are already rich, which you ain't.
reduce government regulation of the economy, causing the banks to almost bankrupt the country.
control the money supply to reduce inflation. another failure.